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Suspension travel modification?
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You mean channelling all the mounting points upwards?
-----Original Message-----
From: L F [mailto:rocco16v@netzero.net]
Sent: December 25, 2002 6:19 AM
To: vince@performancecarstereo.com; Neal Tovsen; Drew Teague;
scirocco-l@scirocco.org
Subject: Re: Suspension travel modification?
One-word answer to your problem:
channel
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: Vince Royer
To: Neal Tovsen ; Drew Teague ; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2002 1:15 PM
Subject: RE: Suspension travel modification?
I would love to modify my suspension travel so that I can tuck all my
wheels
deep into my fenders and still have stock-like handling. mmmm...
I figure I would have to rework the front upper strut mounts, notch the
frame, and somehow modify the pickup points as mentioned below to save
the
geometry from getting too screwed up. I think that would be dope.
Vince
> -----Original Message-----
> From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
> [mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Neal Tovsen
> Sent: December 24, 2002 11:57 AM
> To: Drew Teague; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> Subject: Re: Suspension travel modification?
>
>
> > Is there a
> > suspension setup that
> > would effectively increase the suspension travel for
> > off-road applications?
> > That would be worth doing, even if not to race, just
> > to off-road. It would
> > be nice to be able to use larger tires, too. (clear
> > the wheelwells?)
> > Something tells me it might end up taking a decent
> > amount of fabrication.
>
> Well, the A1 suspension travel really isn't all that
> short. If you want to see an example of a short-travel
> suspension, take a look at a Neon sometime.
>
> However, it isn't very long either, and as we
> discussed, there are much better choices than an A1
> for rally or off-road use. The Subaru Impreza, for
> example, has HUGE suspension travel compared to the
> Scirocco (gee...maybe that has something to do with a
> certain WRC design strategy!).
>
> The Scirocco's droop suspension travel could be
> lengthened with custom extra-long struts, but I would
> guess that it would cause toe and camber problems if
> you extend the control arm too much further down than
> stock.
>
> You could theoretically also increase the bump
> suspension travel quite a ways without hitting the
> fender with the tire as long as you don't run a huge
> tire. Running a shorter body strut would give you some
> extra travel. However, you'll find that the limiting
> factor is when the driveshaft contacts the frame rail,
> especially on the longer passenger side shaft. This is
> a major headache for Street-Prepared autocross cars
> who can't lower the car like they want. The
> Prepared-class autocrossers are allowed to notch the
> frame rail and reinforce it to allow for more bump
> travel.
>
> I'm personally considering mimicing the Golf Syncro
> front driveshaft layout (without the differential)
> someday in the future for my Street Modified Scirocco.
> It actually utilizes equal-length CV joints by
> relocating the passenger side CV ouboard closer to the
> framerail (mirroring the driver's side). With the CV
> joint moved to near the frame rail, you can get more
> upward articulation before the driveshaft contacts the
> frame.
>
> In the end, it is difficult to modify a strut
> suspension for longer travel than it was designed for.
> The dynamic camber and toe changes make things
> difficult unless you plan to relocate the strut and
> control arm pickup points...
>
> Neal
>
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<DIV><SPAN class=975570716-25122002><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>You
mean channelling all the mounting points upwards?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> L F
[mailto:rocco16v@netzero.net]<BR><B>Sent:</B> December 25, 2002 6:19
AM<BR><B>To:</B> vince@performancecarstereo.com; Neal Tovsen; Drew Teague;
scirocco-l@scirocco.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Suspension travel
modification?<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>One-word answer to your problem:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>channel</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Larry</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=vince@performancecarstereo.com
href="mailto:vince@performancecarstereo.com";>Vince Royer</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=nealtovsen@yahoo.com
href="mailto:nealtovsen@yahoo.com";>Neal Tovsen</A> ; <A
title=roccnroll@hotmail.com href="mailto:roccnroll@hotmail.com";>Drew
Teague</A> ; <A title=scirocco-l@scirocco.org
href="mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, December 24, 2002 1:15
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: Suspension travel
modification?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I would love to modify my suspension travel so that I can
tuck all my wheels<BR>deep into my fenders and still have stock-like
handling. mmmm...<BR><BR>I figure I would have to rework the front
upper strut mounts, notch the<BR>frame, and somehow modify the pickup points
as mentioned below to save the<BR>geometry from getting too screwed
up. I think that would be dope.<BR><BR>Vince<BR><BR><BR>>
-----Original Message-----<BR>> From: <A
href="mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org";>scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org</A><BR>>
[<A
href="mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org";>mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org</A>]On
Behalf Of Neal Tovsen<BR>> Sent: December 24, 2002 11:57 AM<BR>> To:
Drew Teague; <A
href="mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A><BR>>
Subject: Re: Suspension travel modification?<BR>><BR>><BR>> > Is
there a<BR>> > suspension setup that<BR>> > would effectively
increase the suspension travel for<BR>> > off-road
applications?<BR>> > That would be worth doing, even if not to race,
just<BR>> > to off-road. It would<BR>> > be nice to be
able to use larger tires, too. (clear<BR>> > the wheelwells?)<BR>>
> Something tells me it might end up taking a decent<BR>> > amount
of fabrication.<BR>><BR>> Well, the A1 suspension travel really isn't
all that<BR>> short. If you want to see an example of a
short-travel<BR>> suspension, take a look at a Neon
sometime.<BR>><BR>> However, it isn't very long either, and as
we<BR>> discussed, there are much better choices than an A1<BR>> for
rally or off-road use. The Subaru Impreza, for<BR>> example, has HUGE
suspension travel compared to the<BR>> Scirocco (gee...maybe that has
something to do with a<BR>> certain WRC design
strategy!).<BR>><BR>> The Scirocco's droop suspension travel could
be<BR>> lengthened with custom extra-long struts, but I would<BR>>
guess that it would cause toe and camber problems if<BR>> you extend the
control arm too much further down than<BR>> stock.<BR>><BR>> You
could theoretically also increase the bump<BR>> suspension travel quite a
ways without hitting the<BR>> fender with the tire as long as you don't
run a huge<BR>> tire. Running a shorter body strut would give you
some<BR>> extra travel. However, you'll find that the limiting<BR>>
factor is when the driveshaft contacts the frame rail,<BR>> especially on
the longer passenger side shaft. This is<BR>> a major headache for
Street-Prepared autocross cars<BR>> who can't lower the car like they
want. The<BR>> Prepared-class autocrossers are allowed to notch
the<BR>> frame rail and reinforce it to allow for more bump<BR>>
travel.<BR>><BR>> I'm personally considering mimicing the Golf
Syncro<BR>> front driveshaft layout (without the differential)<BR>>
someday in the future for my Street Modified Scirocco.<BR>> It actually
utilizes equal-length CV joints by<BR>> relocating the passenger side CV
ouboard closer to the<BR>> framerail (mirroring the driver's side). With
the CV<BR>> joint moved to near the frame rail, you can get more<BR>>
upward articulation before the driveshaft contacts the<BR>>
frame.<BR>><BR>> In the end, it is difficult to modify a strut<BR>>
suspension for longer travel than it was designed for.<BR>> The dynamic
camber and toe changes make things<BR>> difficult unless you plan to
relocate the strut and<BR>> control arm pickup points...<BR>><BR>>
Neal<BR>><BR>>
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