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Suspension travel modification?
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One-word answer to your problem:
channel
Larry
----- Original Message -----=20
From: Vince Royer=20
To: Neal Tovsen ; Drew Teague ; scirocco-l@scirocco.org=20
Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2002 1:15 PM
Subject: RE: Suspension travel modification?
I would love to modify my suspension travel so that I can tuck all my =
wheels
deep into my fenders and still have stock-like handling. mmmm...
I figure I would have to rework the front upper strut mounts, notch =
the
frame, and somehow modify the pickup points as mentioned below to save =
the
geometry from getting too screwed up. I think that would be dope.
Vince
> -----Original Message-----
> From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
> [mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Neal Tovsen
> Sent: December 24, 2002 11:57 AM
> To: Drew Teague; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> Subject: Re: Suspension travel modification?
>
>
> > Is there a
> > suspension setup that
> > would effectively increase the suspension travel for
> > off-road applications?
> > That would be worth doing, even if not to race, just
> > to off-road. It would
> > be nice to be able to use larger tires, too. (clear
> > the wheelwells?)
> > Something tells me it might end up taking a decent
> > amount of fabrication.
>
> Well, the A1 suspension travel really isn't all that
> short. If you want to see an example of a short-travel
> suspension, take a look at a Neon sometime.
>
> However, it isn't very long either, and as we
> discussed, there are much better choices than an A1
> for rally or off-road use. The Subaru Impreza, for
> example, has HUGE suspension travel compared to the
> Scirocco (gee...maybe that has something to do with a
> certain WRC design strategy!).
>
> The Scirocco's droop suspension travel could be
> lengthened with custom extra-long struts, but I would
> guess that it would cause toe and camber problems if
> you extend the control arm too much further down than
> stock.
>
> You could theoretically also increase the bump
> suspension travel quite a ways without hitting the
> fender with the tire as long as you don't run a huge
> tire. Running a shorter body strut would give you some
> extra travel. However, you'll find that the limiting
> factor is when the driveshaft contacts the frame rail,
> especially on the longer passenger side shaft. This is
> a major headache for Street-Prepared autocross cars
> who can't lower the car like they want. The
> Prepared-class autocrossers are allowed to notch the
> frame rail and reinforce it to allow for more bump
> travel.
>
> I'm personally considering mimicing the Golf Syncro
> front driveshaft layout (without the differential)
> someday in the future for my Street Modified Scirocco.
> It actually utilizes equal-length CV joints by
> relocating the passenger side CV ouboard closer to the
> framerail (mirroring the driver's side). With the CV
> joint moved to near the frame rail, you can get more
> upward articulation before the driveshaft contacts the
> frame.
>
> In the end, it is difficult to modify a strut
> suspension for longer travel than it was designed for.
> The dynamic camber and toe changes make things
> difficult unless you plan to relocate the strut and
> control arm pickup points...
>
> Neal
>
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>One-word answer to your =
problem:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>channel</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Larry</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
<A href=3D"mailto:vince@performancecarstereo.com"=20
title=3Dvince@performancecarstereo.com>Vince Royer</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
href=3D"mailto:nealtovsen@yahoo.com"=20
title=3Dnealtovsen@yahoo.com>Neal Tovsen</A> ; <A=20
href=3D"mailto:roccnroll@hotmail.com"; =
title=3Droccnroll@hotmail.com>Drew=20
Teague</A> ; <A href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org"=20
title=3Dscirocco-l@scirocco.org>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, December 24, =
2002 1:15=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: Suspension travel=20
modification?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I would love to modify my suspension travel so that I =
can tuck=20
all my wheels<BR>deep into my fenders and still have stock-like=20
handling. mmmm...<BR><BR>I figure I would have to rework the =
front upper=20
strut mounts, notch the<BR>frame, and somehow modify the pickup points =
as=20
mentioned below to save the<BR>geometry from getting too screwed =
up. I=20
think that would be dope.<BR><BR>Vince<BR><BR><BR>> -----Original=20
Message-----<BR>> From: <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org";>scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.o=
rg</A><BR>>=20
[<A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org";>mailto:scirocco-l-admin@sci=
rocco.org</A>]On=20
Behalf Of Neal Tovsen<BR>> Sent: December 24, 2002 11:57 AM<BR>> =
To:=20
Drew Teague; <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A><BR>&g=
t;=20
Subject: Re: Suspension travel modification?<BR>><BR>><BR>> =
> Is=20
there a<BR>> > suspension setup that<BR>> > would =
effectively=20
increase the suspension travel for<BR>> > off-road =
applications?<BR>>=20
> That would be worth doing, even if not to race, just<BR>> > =
to=20
off-road. It would<BR>> > be nice to be able to use larger =
tires,=20
too. (clear<BR>> > the wheelwells?)<BR>> > Something tells =
me it=20
might end up taking a decent<BR>> > amount of=20
fabrication.<BR>><BR>> Well, the A1 suspension travel really =
isn't all=20
that<BR>> short. If you want to see an example of a =
short-travel<BR>>=20
suspension, take a look at a Neon sometime.<BR>><BR>> However, =
it isn't=20
very long either, and as we<BR>> discussed, there are much better =
choices=20
than an A1<BR>> for rally or off-road use. The Subaru Impreza, =
for<BR>>=20
example, has HUGE suspension travel compared to the<BR>> Scirocco=20
(gee...maybe that has something to do with a<BR>> certain WRC =
design=20
strategy!).<BR>><BR>> The Scirocco's droop suspension travel =
could=20
be<BR>> lengthened with custom extra-long struts, but I =
would<BR>> guess=20
that it would cause toe and camber problems if<BR>> you extend the =
control=20
arm too much further down than<BR>> stock.<BR>><BR>> You =
could=20
theoretically also increase the bump<BR>> suspension travel quite a =
ways=20
without hitting the<BR>> fender with the tire as long as you don't =
run a=20
huge<BR>> tire. Running a shorter body strut would give you =
some<BR>>=20
extra travel. However, you'll find that the limiting<BR>> factor is =
when=20
the driveshaft contacts the frame rail,<BR>> especially on the =
longer=20
passenger side shaft. This is<BR>> a major headache for =
Street-Prepared=20
autocross cars<BR>> who can't lower the car like they want. =
The<BR>>=20
Prepared-class autocrossers are allowed to notch the<BR>> frame =
rail and=20
reinforce it to allow for more bump<BR>> travel.<BR>><BR>> =
I'm=20
personally considering mimicing the Golf Syncro<BR>> front =
driveshaft=20
layout (without the differential)<BR>> someday in the future for my =
Street=20
Modified Scirocco.<BR>> It actually utilizes equal-length CV joints =
by<BR>> relocating the passenger side CV ouboard closer to =
the<BR>>=20
framerail (mirroring the driver's side). With the CV<BR>> joint =
moved to=20
near the frame rail, you can get more<BR>> upward articulation =
before the=20
driveshaft contacts the<BR>> frame.<BR>><BR>> In the end, it =
is=20
difficult to modify a strut<BR>> suspension for longer travel than =
it was=20
designed for.<BR>> The dynamic camber and toe changes make =
things<BR>>=20
difficult unless you plan to relocate the strut and<BR>> control =
arm pickup=20
points...<BR>><BR>> Neal<BR>><BR>>=20
__________________________________________________<BR>> Do you=20
Yahoo!?<BR>> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up =
now.<BR>>=20
<A=20
=
href=3D"http://mailplus.yahoo.com";>http://mailplus.yahoo.com</A><BR>><=
BR>>=20
_______________________________________________<BR>> Scirocco-l =
mailing=20
list<BR>> <A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:Scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A><BR>&g=
t; <A=20
=
href=3D"http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l";>http://neubayer=
n.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l</A><BR>><BR><BR><BR>________________=
_______________________________<BR>Scirocco-l=20
mailing list<BR><A=20
=
href=3D"mailto:Scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org</A><BR><A=
=20
=
href=3D"http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l";>http://neubayer=
n.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l</A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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