[TECH] Cis to CIS w/ Knock Box

[Dan Bubb" <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com (Dan Bubb)]

Yeah, the 16V has two switches. WOT switch up on top in the "normal" place
and the idle switch underneath the primary plate.
The knock ignition needs two switches. An idle switch and WOT switch.
Fuel needs only the WOT switch.
On the 16V with CIS-e they are integrated. The WOT switch provides input to
both the fuel computer and the knock box.
On your car with CIS you will need the idle switch and TWO WOT switches. You
need two WOT switches because for the fuel the pin on the computer gets
grounded when the switch is closed and for the ignition the pin on the knock
box is supplied 12V when the switch is closed.
So, you can do this two ways:
1. piggyback the two WOT switches on top of each other. This is pretty easy
to do. The downside is the extra weight of the additional switch kept
breaking the switch bracket! Really! I ended up welding a 3/16" bar across
the area that kept breaking.
2. Wire the output of the ignition WOT switch to a relay (and also the knock
box, of course) and have the relay ground the pin on the fuel computer.
Little wiring work, but I bet that goddamned switch bracket won't keep
breaking!

I know this seems like a PITA, but for the knock ignition to work correctly
it really needs both the idle and WOT switches and, of course, we know the
fuel computer needs it's little WOT switch or the mixture is too lean for
max power.
HTH
If this still isn't clear keep asking and I'll see if I can word it
differently to get you over the hump.
Dan

----- Original Message -----
From: "ATS - Patrick Bureau" <txrocco@sbcglobal.net>
To: "Dan Bubb" <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com>; "_Scirocco Mailing List"
<scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 2:36 AM
Subject: RE: [TECH] Cis to CIS w/ Knock Box


> Dan,
>
> Are you telling me that on 16v rocco there is 2 throttle switches? one to
> the knock box , and one to the ecu?
> maybe I don't understand what you are explaining, maybe my english to
french
> is not as good as I though it was...
>
> I don't recall seeing on the 3a complete engine 2 switches on the throttle
> body of the audi.
>
> Brian Wagner, you have the audi TB, I gave it to you integral me removing
it
> from the engine, could you check for me please if indeed it does, maybe I
> can find something to trade back for the second switch assembly and save
me
> the time to find another (Pluuuuueeeeeaaaassseeeee).
>
> Please..., explain further, I think I am missing a peice of the puzzle on
my
> conversion...
>
>
> ATS - Patrick Bureau - txrocco@sbcglobal.net
>
>
> =>-----Original Message-----
> =>From: Dan Bubb [mailto:jdbubb@ix.netcom.com]
> =>Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 1:47 PM
> =>To: ATS - Patrick Bureau; _Scirocco Mailing List
> =>Subject: Re: [TECH] Cis to CIS w/ Knock Box
> =>
> =>
> =>Patrick:
> =>Your current full throttle switch needs to stay connected as is.
> =>It signals
> =>the fuel computer you're at WOT.
> =>For the KS ignition you need to have the throttle body that has
> =>both a full
> =>throttle switch and an idle switch off a car that originally had the KS
> =>ignition.
> =>It will have a connector with 3 wires. One is 12V, one goes to pin #8
and
> =>one to pin #6.
> =>As a matter of fact you will need to piggyback your current full
throttle
> =>switch (either mechanically or electrically via a relay) on top
> =>of the full
> =>throttle switch required for the KS ignition. The ignition WOT switch
> =>provides 12V to the KS box at WOT. The fuel WOT switch grounds the pin
on
> =>the fuel box at WOT so you cannot use one switch to signal both fuel and
> =>ignition of WOT unless you set up a relay.
> =>Dan
> =>
> =>----- Original Message -----
> =>From: "ATS - Patrick Bureau" <txrocco@sbcglobal.net>
> =>To: "Dan Bubb" <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com>; "_Scirocco Mailing List"
> =><scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> =>Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 2:28 PM
> =>Subject: RE: [TECH] Cis to CIS w/ Knock Box
> =>
> =>
> =>> thank you, one last question
> =>>
> =>> the knock box runs wires from pin # 8  to full throttle (Blue/Black) a
nd
> =>pin
> =>> #6 closed throttle (white/blue), I will try to dig the info out of
> =>Bentley,
> =>> but on the 85 rocco the wires to the throttle switch are brown/red and
> =>Grey
> =>> anyone know which corresponds to which?
> =>>
> =>> ATS - Patrick Bureau - txrocco@sbcglobal.net
> =>>
> =>>
> =>> =>-----Original Message-----
> =>> =>From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
> =>> =>[mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Dan Bubb
> =>> =>Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 12:49 PM
> =>> =>To: ATS - Patrick Bureau; _Scirocco Mailing List
> =>> =>Subject: Re: [TECH] Cis to CIS w/ Knock Box
> =>> =>
> =>> =>
> =>> =>You remove the hall sender wires from the Ignition Module and
> =>"relocate"
> =>> =>them to the knock box.
> =>> =>The ignition control unit fires when it gets the signal.
> =>> =>With the original distributor with it's mechanical and vacuum
advance
> =>the
> =>> =>hall sender sends the signal at the right time.
> =>> =>With the KS the knock box intercepts the signal from the hall
> =>> =>sender, waits
> =>> =>the appropriate amount of time (for correct advance) then sends the
> =>signal
> =>> =>to the ignition module.
> =>> =>Dan
> =>> =>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> =>>
>