Turbo vs. Supercharger.

[marc at getty.net (Marc Getty)]

As Eric said, superchargers are not worth anything at altitude. Lucky
for me, I live at 45 feet above sea level! The thing I like about my
C230's supercharger is the evenness of the power throughout the band,
no wait for the turbo to spool up, as long as you are in the *VERY*
wide power band you are set.

The 192 HP at 5500 RPM figure does not mean much, but the 205 ft/lbs
of torque at 2500 rpm all the way up to 4800 rpm kicks ass! Just ask
Josh Able who drove my car once (flame suit on, hey I was REAL sick
okay), no real need to shift unless you want good gas mileage, the
power is always there. Or ask Brett V. who was shifting all over the
place to keep up with me on the way home from H20 last year, I just
kept it in 4th the entire time and never had to shift unless we went
over 105 MPH or under 40 MPH. ;-)

Not all superchargers will provide this kind of torque "curve" (mine
is really flat for 2300 RPM, not much of a curve) but my engine &
supercharger combination's "curve" is just an extreme example of this.

-Marc

'87 Tornado Red 16v Bogged Scirocco @ 235K miles
http://getty.net/scirocco/ 
'02 Mercedes-Benz C230 Kompressor Sports Coupe -
http://getty.net/c230k/
    in Heliodongr?n (Citron Green) took European Delivery in May 2002,
    state-side delivery on July 19, 2002, currently at 31,700 miles


-----Original Message-----
From: scirocco-l-bounces@scirocco.org
[mailto:scirocco-l-bounces@scirocco.org] On Behalf Of Eric S
Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2003 12:36 AM
To: dale witt; Neal Tovsen; Scirocco List
Subject: Re: Turbo vs. Supercharger.


Since this topic has come up again....I'll make the same point I
always do.

Since I am a "high lander" at 5200 ft high here in Denver, and
regularly go to the mountains, I would NEVER install a supercharger on
any of my dubs.  With its static spin rate it has NO way to compensate
for the thinner air up here and boosts much less at altitude. 

A turbo, with its freewheeling/free power nature will actually spin
faster at altitude to make the same boost and does an effective job at
almost completely overcoming altitude loss, where NA and supered cars
cannot.

Many of you were impressed by Marc Gettys (spelling?) C230 Kompressor
at Cincy this year...I'll tell you this, those things are absolute
DOGS up here...I know, I test drove one and was throughly
dissapointed...

--
Eric
www.VintageWatercooleds.com

79 VW Iltis
81 Scirocco S (*TDI* swap and complete restoration in holding pattern)
81 Rabbit Truck LX Diesel (FOR SALE!) 81 Rabbit Truck 2.0 16v Motronic
83 Scirocco Wolfsburg 91 Cabriolet (2.0 Crossflow 8v swap and
mechanical rebuild in progress)


--- "dale witt" <dwitt1@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>I was speaking of our dubs in general and VWs attitude on the subject

>of the supercharger.  They could have used the quality of an Eaton or

>Lysholm (they do have deep pockets), but instead they seemed to say
"Oh 
>well, not too good" and they just dumped the G60 like a bad idea. I 
>have several friends that tried to stay loyal to the G60, but have 
>since gone the turbo route, or just gave up on the Corrado
completely.  
>I had every intention to make the Supercharger my next upgrade to my 
>86, now I am pretty much convinced to do the Turbo.  I guess there
have 
>been too many cases of VWs with superchargers going south.
>
>Dale Witt
>03 GTI 20AE
>86.5 2.0 16v Scirocco
>82 2.1 16v Zender Wide Body Scirocco
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Neal Tovsen" <nealtovsen@yahoo.com>
>To: "dale witt" <dwitt1@satx.rr.com>; "Scirocco List"
><Scirocco-l@Scirocco.org>
>Sent: Monday, June 30, 2003 9:34 PM
>Subject: Re: Turbo vs. Supercharger.
>
>
>> ? For the average driver, I believe the
>> > supercharger is just too
>> > high maintenance.
>>
>> I think the ***G60*** was too much maintenance for the average 
>> person. But that is in no way an indication of supercharger 
>> maintenance in general. The G60 design was unique and never 
>> perfected. The technology didn't exist, and nobody invested in it.
>>
>> Eaton or Lysholm units requre no more maintenance than
>> a turbo. Some claim they require less. There's an Eaton-charged 
>> Rabbit on Vortex that claims to have put 150k on his SC after he 
>> pulled it from a junkyard!
>>
>> Neal
>>
>> --- dale witt <dwitt1@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>> > What do you suppose was the thinking at VW, as they
>> > never really made a big
>> > hit with the G60 and pretty much let it take a back
>> > seat to the VR and now
>> > the turbo.  For the average driver, I believe the supercharger is

>> > just too high maintenance.
>> >
>> > Dale Witt
>> > 03 GTI 20AE
>> > 86.5 2.0 16v Scirocco
>> > 82 2.1 16v Zender wide body Scirocco
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "L F" <rocco16v@netzero.net>
>> > To: "Dan Bubb" <jdbubb@ix.netcom.com>; "Mike Smith"
>> > <smithma7@yahoo.com>;
>> > "car" <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>> > Sent: Monday, June 30, 2003 7:14 PM
>> > Subject: Re: Turbo vs. Supercharger.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >   A million opinions!
>> >   Superchargers tend to be less efficient
>> > particularly at higher pressure
>> >   ratios. So, they aren't as good at making really
>> > high power.
>> >
>> >   YOU'D BETTER TELL THAT TO JOHN FORCE, HE COULD USE
>> > SOME ADVICE ABOUT NOW.
>> >
>> >   OTOH a big really high power laggy turbo is the
>> > last thing you need for an
>> >   autocross car. Superchargers, particularly
>> > positive displacement types,
>> > have
>> >   fast response.
>> >   The primary issue then is quick response vs. power producing 
>> > capability.
>> >   There are a million secondary issues!
>> >   just my .02
>> >   Dan
>> >
>> >   AS FOR THE REST, I WHOLEHEARTEDLY AGREE WITH DAN.
>> >   HAVE FUN!
>> >   LARRY
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >
>> >
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>>
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