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Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?

ok, how about this--does the car (when it's in "limp" mode) run the same 
when you disconnect the dpr plug? if it runs different, you aren't really in 
limp mode. quick/dirty check of fuel flow is easy: jump the fp relay, pull 
injectors, lift air sensor plate. very much doubt it's the fuel filter, but 
this should tell you if you're getting proper fuel response. fuel would be 
more pronounced at high rpm; probably wouldn't notice big difference at 
idle. you won't be able to tell the difference at idle with or w/o the o2 
sensor connected. and how about my original questions (see old post below)?


-Michael Abatzis
Hotlanta! GA
1988 Scirocco 2L 16v RIP-->parting, finally taking orders: 
www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/mikes_page1.html
1987 Scirocco 2L 16v...




>From: Ryan H <rhock99@epix.net>
>To: "Chris DeLong" <green536@hotmail.com>
>CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>Subject: Re: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
>Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 0:26:56 -0500
>
>Limp mode IS available on CIS-E in the form of the knock sensor and knock 
>computer!
>
>UPDATE: As of recently, the car began bucking at high RPM, although not in 
>first gear, and only occasionally in second gear (???) - always in third+ 
>gear (WTF???)... now, I've got a BRAND new main AND transfer pump, as well 
>as fuel filter, but I used a junky Purolater fuel filter... anyone have bad 
>experiences with crappy fuel filters?  Fuel filter was replaced around the 
>time the problem started, but so were a lot of things.  Anyway, how could 
>shutting the car off then back on make the fuel filter unclogged?  Grr, I'm 
>out of ideas...
>
>...And my O2 sensor was replaced, mixture was just recently re-adjusted as 
>per Bentley (warm car).  Strange thing is, with or without the O2 sensor 
>connected, the car runs the same... kinda weird, I always thought it would 
>alter it.  Maybe the DPR is the culprit?
>Anyway, mixture fluctuates at ~7 mA, (and 19.6 mA full throttle - anyone 
>ever take readings at WOT that I can compare to?)
>
>Thanks again for ALL input!!!
>
>
>
>
>
> >
> > From: "Chris DeLong" <green536@hotmail.com>
> > Date: 2003/02/18 Tue PM 11:38:14 EST
> > To: JoshuaA.Conner@VerizonWireless.com,  abatzis2@hotmail.com
> > CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> >
> > limp mode isnt really available on CIS-E cars. bsaically if you have a 
>poor
> > reading on the o2 or bad timing the o2 sensor will load up and put the 
>fule
> > mixture on one or the other end of the range causing the car to run like
> > crap. The Bentley manual descibes exactly how to adjust the DPR current.
> > make sure this is done with a warm engine otherwise your final readings 
>and
> > running will be off.
> >
> >
> >
> > Chris DeLong
> > ICQ#45030867
> > Seattle, WA USA
> > '80 16V 'Rocco ragtop
> > '91 GLi 2.0 16V (for sale)
> > '77 Rabbit 16V
> > '61 17 Window type II
> > '91 Vanagon
> > '84 Jetta
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: JoshuaA.Conner@VerizonWireless.com
> > >To: abatzis2@hotmail.com
> > >CC: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > >Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > >Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 23:00:13 -0500
> > >
> > >crappy timing in a nutshell i believe.
> > >
> > >Joshua C.
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Michael Abatzis [mailto:abatzis2@hotmail.com]
> > >Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 10:28 PM
> > >To: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > >Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > >
> > >
> > >yeah, i'm curious as to what "limp mode" means--and what do you get 
>when
> > >you
> > >
> > >check the dpr current? does it matter whether it's hot or cold when you
> > >turn
> > >
> > >it off and on?
> > >
> > >
> > >-Michael Abatzis
> > >Hotlanta! GA
> > >1988 Scirocco 2L 16v RIP-->parting, finally taking orders:
> > >www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/mikes_page1.html
> > >1987 Scirocco 2L 16v...
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >From: "Chris DeLong" <green536@hotmail.com>
> > > >To: dwalter2@wi.rr.com, rhock99@epix.net, scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > > >Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 03:09:37 +0000
> > > >
> > > >have you tried checking/replacing the O2 sensor and setting the fuel
> > > >mixture as per Bentley?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Chris DeLong
> > > >ICQ#45030867
> > > >Seattle, WA USA
> > > >'80 16V 'Rocco ragtop
> > > >'91 GLi 2.0 16V (for sale)
> > > >'77 Rabbit 16V
> > > >'61 17 Window type II
> > > >'91 Vanagon
> > > >'84 Jetta
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>From: "Donald Walter" <dwalter2@wi.rr.com>
> > > >>To: "Donald Walter" <dwalter2@wi.rr.com>,"Ryan H"
> > > >><rhock99@epix.net>,<scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> > > >>Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > > >>Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 21:01:55 -0600
> > > >>
> > > >>The main one that went form the negative terminal of the battery to 
>the
> > > >>transmission, halfway through it had a crimped connector that bolted 
>to
> > > >>the
> > > >>frame back behind the left motor mount (drivers side).  This was for 
>a
> > >16V
> > > >>
> > > >>-----Original Message-----
> > > >>From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
> > > >>[mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Donald Walter
> > > >>Sent: Monday, February 17, 2003 8:14 PM
> > > >>To: Ryan H; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>Subject: RE: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>I had similar problems and went through the same attempted cures.  
>Mine
> > > >>turned out to be a really bad ground strap replaced it with a new 
>one
> > >and
> > > >>it
> > > >>tuned up nicely.
> > > >>
> > > >>Don Walter
> > > >>'69 VW Bettle (used to)
> > > >>'69 Karman Ghia (used to)
> > > >>'70 Karman Ghia (used to)
> > > >>'84 8v Scirocco (sold, wish I hadn't)
> > > >>'86 16V 2.0L Scirocco (daily driver, 150k, rocco #2)
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>_______________________________________________
> > > >>Scirocco-l mailing list
> > > >>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> > > >>
> > > >>-----Original Message-----
> > > >>From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
> > > >>[mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Ryan H
> > > >>Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 9:11 PM
> > > >>To: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>Subject: Desperation... any more ideas (16V problems)?
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>OK, I'm out of ideas.  Car runs in limp mode 90% of the time
> > > >>(progressively
> > > >>got worse).  If I turn it off then on, or nearly stall the engine, 
>it
> > >goes
> > > >>normal for a few minutes.  I've replaced (or swapped) nearly 
>everything
> > >I
> > > >>can think of (list below) that would be related.  Still nothing.  
>Anyone
> > > >>near Scranton PA that would be willing to help me with the car?  
>Like
> > >take
> > > >>it off my hands and try to fix it for however long it takes.  I'd 
>pay
> > >$200
> > >
> > > >>+
> > > >>whatever parts need to be replaced to anyone who could figure it 
>out...
> > > >>really.
> > > >>
> > > >>OK, here's the list of things done:
> > > >>New fuel filter (cheap one, though, but still...)
> > > >>New knock sensor
> > > >>Swapped knock boxes & ICM (tried 2 different ones)
> > > >>Swapped distrib/hall sender
> > > >>Swapped coil (part store only had 8V coil, but it still did the same
> > > >>thing... can't find a 16V coil to test with)
> > > >>Timed motor many times
> > > >>New rotor/cap
> > > >>New plugs/wires
> > > >>Swapped coolant sensor
> > > >>New main pump
> > > >>New transfer pump
> > > >>Hardwired FP relay
> > > >>Checked & cleaned as many connections as I could
> > > >>
> > > >>This problem bothers me even more because the car runs sooo strong 
>when
> > > >>it's
> > > >>normal.  When it's not, I can't even get to 4000+ rpm.  Geo Metros 
>pass
> > >me
> > > >>like I'm stopped. :o
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>_______________________________________________
> > > >>Scirocco-l mailing list
> > > >>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>_______________________________________________
> > > >>Scirocco-l mailing list
> > > >>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>_______________________________________________
> > > >>Scirocco-l mailing list
> > > >>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > >>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> > > >
> > > >
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