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What would this do... (technobabble)
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nuclear trained navy people have the benefit of some well rounded technical training, but as some listers know, they dont teach quaife operation :).
Al
----- Original Message -----
From: Brandon Smith
To: Allyn ; SCIROCCO-LIST
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: What would this do... (technobabble)
Someone sounds like they know a bit about Mechanical Engineering. I am an ME student at Colorado State, what you said very true.
Most of the few times i've seen people do this, the first thing that usually starts to go is their piston rings... especially when they do something stupid like run that Valvoline VR-1 Racing oil in a 20w-50 in the Dead of winter in colorado at 5:30 in the morning. (come one now...some of you i'm sure have a cousin or something that did this in their Mazda Protege...mine did...dumbass).
-Brando
----- Original Message -----
From: Allyn
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 2:18 PM
To: Vince Royer; Scirocco List
Subject: Re: What would this do... (technobabble)
1. when cold, the oil is too viscous. in extreme cases, its so thick that it
cant properly flow into areas of tight tolerance, resulting in those areas
wearing. keep that up a few times and eventually you have something major go.
2. your engine does not warm up evenly. during the warmup process there are
large differences in temperature across the thick portions of the block/head.
this temperature difference results in high tensile stresses in some areas.
throwing high rpm stresses in there may be enough to make some preexisting flaw
start spreading into a large crack.
3. operation at high rpm implies faster heatup of the metal (due to faster
combustion/friction/etc), making the temperature difference greater, and the
tensile stresses (#2) even higher.
4. when cold, metal has a lower stress point where it will fracture. this makes
#2 even worse if the stresses are in an area that hasnt warmed up yet.
other babble to throw around:
Fracture toughness (KIC): ability of a metal to prevent a preexisting crack from
propogating under a given tensile stress level.
Thermal stresses: tensile stresses due to temperature difference across an
object.
side note: there are very specific rules for running reactors that govern rates
that you can heat up/cool down. they get much more restrictive the colder you
go. reactors arent much different than engines, as both are just hunks of metal.
HTH
Al
Allyn Malventano, ETC(SS), USN
87 Rieger GTO Scirocco 16v (daily driver, 180k, rocco #6)
86 Kamei Twin 16V Turbo Scirocco GTX ('it has begun', rocco #7)
86.5 Occo 16v Trailer (dotting 'i's across the country, rocco #8)
87 Jetta 8v Wolfsburg 2dr (daily driver, 260k, 0 rattles, original clutch,
driveshafts, wheels :)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vince Royer" <vince@performancecarstereo.com>
To: "Scirocco List" <scirocco-L@scirocco.org>
Sent: Friday, October 04, 2002 2:40 PM
Subject: What would this do...
> Hey guys,
>
> Just a little fun question to throw at you. Does anybody have any detailed
> examples of what might happen If I were to run my motor at really high RPM's
> while it's cold, perhaps repeatedly.
>
> I'm looking for things like metal chips in the oil, loss of compression,
> etc. I need realistic answers to things that would actually happen, so that
> I can explain them as if they did happen and somebody would believe me, even
> a mechanic, or an insurance adjuster or something.
>
> Go nuts.
>
> Vince
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Scirocco-l mailing list
> Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
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<DIV><FONT face=Arial>nuclear trained navy people have the benefit of some well
rounded technical training, but as some listers know, they dont teach quaife
operation :).</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial>Al</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=SCIROCCO_SPEED@msn.com href="mailto:SCIROCCO_SPEED@msn.com";>Brandon
Smith</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=amalventano1@comcast.net
href="mailto:amalventano1@comcast.net";>Allyn</A> ; <A
title=scirocco-l@scirocco.org
href="mailto:scirocco-l@scirocco.org";>SCIROCCO-LIST</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, October 04, 2002 6:12
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: What would this do...
(technobabble)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Someone sounds like they know a bit about Mechanical Engineering. I
am an ME student at Colorado State, what you said very true.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Most of the few times i've seen people do this, the first thing that
usually starts to go is their piston rings... especially when they do
something stupid like run that Valvoline VR-1 Racing oil in a 20w-50 in the
Dead of winter in colorado at 5:30 in the morning. (come one now...some
of you i'm sure have a cousin or something that did this in their Mazda
Protege...mine did...dumbass).</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>-Brando </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial">----- Original Message -----</DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt Arial; COLOR: black"><B>From:</B>
Allyn</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, October 04, 2002 2:18
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>To:</B> Vince Royer; Scirocco List</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt Arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: What would this do...
(technobabble)</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>1. when cold, the oil is too viscous. in extreme cases, its
so thick that it<BR>cant properly flow into areas of tight tolerance,
resulting in those areas<BR>wearing. keep that up a few times and eventually
you have something major go.<BR>2. your engine does not warm up evenly.
during the warmup process there are<BR>large differences in temperature
across the thick portions of the block/head.<BR>this temperature difference
results in high tensile stresses in some areas.<BR>throwing high rpm
stresses in there may be enough to make some preexisting flaw<BR>start
spreading into a large crack.<BR>3. operation at high rpm implies faster
heatup of the metal (due to faster<BR>combustion/friction/etc), making the
temperature difference greater, and the<BR>tensile stresses (#2) even
higher.<BR>4. when cold, metal has a lower stress point where it will
fracture. this makes<BR>#2 even worse if the stresses are in an area that
hasnt warmed up yet.<BR><BR>other babble to throw around:<BR>Fracture
toughness (KIC): ability of a metal to prevent a preexisting crack
from<BR>propogating under a given tensile stress level.<BR>Thermal stresses:
tensile stresses due to temperature difference across
an<BR>object.<BR><BR>side note: there are very specific rules for running
reactors that govern rates<BR>that you can heat up/cool down. they get much
more restrictive the colder you<BR>go. reactors arent much different than
engines, as both are just hunks of metal.<BR><BR>HTH<BR>Al<BR><BR>Allyn
Malventano, ETC(SS), USN<BR>87 Rieger GTO Scirocco 16v (daily driver, 180k,
rocco #6)<BR>86 Kamei Twin 16V Turbo Scirocco GTX ('it has begun', rocco
#7)<BR>86.5 Occo 16v Trailer (dotting 'i's across the country, rocco
#8)<BR>87 Jetta 8v Wolfsburg 2dr (daily driver, 260k, 0 rattles, original
clutch,<BR>driveshafts, wheels :)<BR><BR>----- Original Message
-----<BR>From: "Vince Royer" <vince@performancecarstereo.com><BR>To:
"Scirocco List" <scirocco-L@scirocco.org><BR>Sent: Friday, October 04,
2002 2:40 PM<BR>Subject: What would this do...<BR><BR><BR>> Hey
guys,<BR>><BR>> Just a little fun question to throw at you. Does
anybody have any detailed<BR>> examples of what might happen If I were to
run my motor at really high RPM's<BR>> while it's cold, perhaps
repeatedly.<BR>><BR>> I'm looking for things like metal chips in the
oil, loss of compression,<BR>> etc. I need realistic answers to
things that would actually happen, so that<BR>> I can explain them as if
they did happen and somebody would believe me, even<BR>> a mechanic, or
an insurance adjuster or something.<BR>><BR>> Go nuts.<BR>><BR>>
Vince<BR>><BR>><BR>>
_______________________________________________<BR>> Scirocco-l mailing
list<BR>> Scirocco-l@scirocco.org<BR>>
http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l<BR><BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>Scirocco-l
mailing
list<BR>Scirocco-l@scirocco.org<BR>http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR
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