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Larry, I mis-spoke (Notching the piston for power)

Subject: Larry, I mis-spoke (Notching the piston for power)
From: pb3vr6 at yahoo.com (Tonee Northam)
Date: Tue Sep 14 00:10:01 2004
In-reply-to: <20040914050520.19586.qmail@web51606.mail.yahoo.com>

That's why alot of airlines that fly into airports have rid themselves of the EMB-120, ATR's, etc. The deicing boot is pretty much useless under extreme icing conditions, go figure, alot of those a/c are made in Brazil.
 
Tonee

Lars Bruchmann <pilotlars@yahoo.com> wrote:
roselawn indiana.. terrible accident, the auto flight
system kicked off, and the plane experienced an
un-commanded aileron roll, went inverted, and dove
into the ground. a ridge of ice had formed aft of the
de-ice boot, and the turbulence (just what we're
trying to accomplish in the engines..) cause the
aileron to flip up. i am an aviation safety minor in
college.. haha. 
--- Tonee Northam 
wrote:

> American Eagle flight crashed due to it, ATR twin
> turbo prop, only the planes "box" showed what it's
> instuments had reported. You'll have to remember
> that I worked commercial airlines for 7+ years, you
> never forget "those things".
> 
> But back to the automobile, if nascar has been
> modding their pistons since the eighties then they
> must be doing something right, the last time I
> checked my rabbit doesn't go 200+ an hour for 3-4
> hours, well, atleast not on the same tires! hehe
> 
> Tonee
> 
> 
> Lars Bruchmann 
wrote:
> you win the snickers bar!! yes, rime is opague, and
> rippled or pitted, clear ice is, eh, well, clear!! 
> wow. we've seen both kinds in the winter, on
> pavement. both add weight and destroy lift, increase
> stall speed, but rime creates lots of drag too! it
> causes some accidents, but by the time the feds get
> there is it melted, the perfect killer!!! wow, i
> just
> thought up a plan to deal with the ex... hehehehe
> --- Tonee Northam 
> wrote:
> 
> > I have to agree with Lars, You would need smooth
> air
> > flow over the wings of an aircraft otherwise it
> > would create drag and affect the lift on the
> > aircraft. All aircraft have some kind of damage on
> > them, the more dimples on the fuselage the harder
> it
> > is to control the flight.
> > 
> > But again we're dealing with something completely
> > different than an airplane. VW's are pennies
> > compared to planes.
> > 
> > Lars, Rime Ice?
> > 
> > Tonee
> > 
> > Lars Bruchmann 
> wrote:
> > i have never heard of hail-damaged aircraft flying
> > faster, except maybe for the pilots trying to get
> > the
> > aircraft to the ground before it is destroyed
> > completely. modern aircraft have super-critical
> wing
> > and fuselage shapes, the boundry layer is
> extremely
> > close to the surface. dimples would not help. 
> > the dimples in a golf ball create an 'artificial
> > boundry layer' which lets the ball fly farther. 
> > aircraft have VGs (vortex generaters), strakes and
> > fences on wing surfaces to do the same thing. 
> > a dirty aircraft will not fly as fast, since the
> > dirt
> > actually raises the boundry layer, and creates
> drag.
> > 
> > a wet aircraft will not fly as fast either. ice is
> > the worst, there is a type of ice that forms,
> which
> > is
> > kinda dimpled, and it is really bad news. so, as
> far
> > as i'm concerned, dimples are bad for aircraft.
> but
> > they could be great for indian cars! :-) 
> > --- David Utley wrote:
> > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Larry Fry [mailto:rocco16@sbcglobal.net]
> > > Sent: Monday, September 13, 2004 9:21 PM
> > > To: fahrvegnugen@cox.net;
> scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > Subject: Re: Re: Larry, I mis-spoke (Notching
> the
> > > piston for power)
> > > 
> > > Why do we care how fast the intake air travels
> > > "across the piston"? Once
> > > it's inside the combustion chamber, it's a moot
> > > point, since the old-tech
> > > design of our engines is not of the 'high-swirl'
> > > type anyway.
> > > As usual, I'm a bit skeptical of stuff like
> > > this....but, when I hear of
> > > Roush, or Yates, or Lingenfelter dimpling their
> > > pistons I will reverse my
> > > postion.
> > > :)
> > > Larry
> > > 
> > > Larry,
> > > They would have, had they been doing NASCAR back
> > > in the eighties. You
> > > know, like when our cars were made? Besides, the
> > > argument that our cars are
> > > too old-tech a design to benefit seems weak as
> > well.
> > > Megasquirt is about as
> > > new as it gets, and I think that all here that
> > have
> > > experience with it would
> > > argue that it is VERY beneficial... Besides,
> yours
> > > is a 16V, yes? It is
> > > high enough a compression to benefit...
> > > It seems our arguments as of late seem to be
> more
> > > about logic and sophistry,
> > > rather than engineering... What's up? :)
> > > 
> > > David
> > > > What I am suggesting is putting dimples in the
> > > piston face, not the
> > > perimeter... Air at speed does not do well with
> 90
> > > degree, much less 180
> > > degree changes of direction. These dimples, or
> > > pockets of air, create a
> > > cushion of air that acts as a buffer. As the air
> > > travels over the surface
> > > of something, the air is slowed by the
> difference
> > in
> > > speed of the two. The
> > > pockets acts a buffers in this regard, allowing
> > the
> > > air to travel more
> > > quickly across the surface.
> > > >
> > > > I tried to find something via Google, about
> > > jetliners with hail damage
> > > actually flying faster, but could turn up
> > nothing...
> > > You have seen the
> > > commercial for Lexus, haven't you? I might find
> > > more if I looked at golf
> > > ball history, I don't know... What I do know is
> > > that this works... :-)
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > David
> > > 
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Scirocco-l mailing list
> > > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
> > > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
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> > 
> > 
> > 93' Corrado VR6 (Baby) 
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> 
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> 93' Corrado VR6 (Baby) 
> 00' Rabbit GTI GLX VR6 (Sleeper) 
> 00' Plymouth Voyager SE (Wife's Winter Driver) 
> 94' Passat GLX VR6 (Now Jarrett's Newer B3) 
> *****Rice, Marinated and Grilled Daily By German
> Engineered Weber Grill*****
> 


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93' Corrado VR6 (Baby) 
00' Rabbit GTI GLX VR6 (Sleeper) 
00' Plymouth Voyager SE (Wife's Winter Driver) 
94' Passat GLX VR6 (Now Jarrett's Newer B3) 
*****Rice, Marinated and Grilled Daily By German Engineered Weber Grill*****

Follow-Ups:
- Larry, I mis-spoke (Notching the piston for power)
  - From: dconyers at gmail.com (Douglas Conyers)

References:
- Larry, I mis-spoke (Notching the piston for power)
  - From: pilotlars at yahoo.com (Lars Bruchmann)

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