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battery relocation question

Subject: battery relocation question
From: rfkellner@snet.net (Rick Kellner)
Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 18:21:04 -0500
In-reply-to: <20030226181939.14A1E45E7@sitemail.everyone.net>
Has anyone used this 'kit' from Accel?  It is 20' of 2GA wire for $50
($2.50/ft).

http://www.carshopinc.com/product/details/ACL-2842.shtml




-----Original Message-----
From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
[mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org] On Behalf Of Haygood
Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2003 1:20 PM
To: Jason Adams; Drew Teague; haygood@aemail4u.com;
rocco_crossing@hotmail.com; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
Subject: Re: battery relocation question

So I'm sure it's not what you meant by "no matter how", but lowering the
C.G. or changing the weight distribution by adding weight is NEVER a
good thing.  Only mention it because I went ten rounds with some
"engineers" in school about this.  Finally won the arguement on the
skidpad.  

So yeah, lower is better, and further back is better.  Which one wins is
a good question.  Only reason I didn't use the spare tire well was
because I keep a spare tire there.  Seemed like a good reason at the
time. :)  

I'm a big fan of balancing weight distribution front-to-rear.  Maybe too
much of one, but we may never know.  I kinda figure that compared to
real sports cars, our cars are really far off on front/rear W.D, and not
so bad on C.G. height.  Just an opinion really.  Within the year I plan
to recess my battery into the trunk floor at the rear of the trunk, so
I'll have both accomplished before too long.

BH 

--- "Jason Adams" <roclist@accessconsulting.ca> wrote:
>I would expect that lowering the c.g. of the car is good no matter how
it's
>done, that being said the lower the battery, the better...
>
>
>Jason Adams
>Fahrvergnugen Forever! ;)
>84 rocco 16v
>93 320i
>98 Z71
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Drew Teague" <roccnroll@hotmail.com>
>To: <haygood@aemail4u.com>; <roclist@accessconsulting.ca>;
><rocco_crossing@hotmail.com>; <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 8:57 AM
>Subject: Re: battery relocation question
>
>
>> Just a quick question after reading this:  Would handling be better
with
>the
>> weight closer to the ground (i.e. spare tire well) or farther back to
>> distribute the weight a bit more evenly?  Not having had much
experience
>> with all this, I would imagine getting it closer to the ground would
>reduce
>> roll a bit, which I would think would be optimal.
>>
>> ...My $.02
>>
>> Drew
>>
>> **Drew Teague**
>> Harrisburg, PA
>>
>> `84 8v Rocco --  "Bruise"
>> `85 BMW 318
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >From: Haygood <haygood@aemail4u.com>
>> >Reply-To: haygood@aemail4u.com
>> >To: "Jason Adams" <roclist@accessconsulting.ca>,"Rhett Farnum"
>> ><rocco_crossing@hotmail.com>, scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> >Subject: Re: battery relocation question
>> >Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:22:26 -0800 (PST)
>> >
>> >Deep cycle means you can discharge it more without killing it.  They
are
>> >used for things like trolling motors on boats that do a lot of work
>between
>> >charges.  You don't need that.  You want gell cell.
>> >
>> >As for mounting position, don't just worry about countering your
weight.
>> >These cars have over 60% of there weight on the front end.  Counter
that!
>> >Put the batt as far back as you can get it.  The whole "centered
over the
>> >rear axle" thing is a mystery to me as well.  Sounds nice, but from
an
>> >engineering standpoint there is nothing magical about that area.
>> >
>> >The downside of placing it further back is that the further from the
CG
>you
>> >place things, the harder it is to rotate the car in a turn.  If, for
>> >example, your car's weight distribution starts out at 65% front and
35%
>> >rear, you are 15% away from the ideal of 50/50 (which is itself
>debateably
>> >ideal, but go with it).  Basic numbers I ran a while back (so they
may
>have
>> >lost accuracy with time :) ), suggested that putting the batt behind
the
>> >rear seat would make you something like 62/37, and putting it in the
rear
>> >of the trunk did something like 60 or 61/whatever.  Keep in mind
that a
>> >difference of "1" there is huge because we are only "15" away from
the
>> >ideal.
>> >
>> >So there is an incentive to move it far back.
>> >
>> >As for the increased rotational inertia, that batt., when in the
rear of
>> >the trunk, is no further from the rear axle than it was from the
front
>> >axle.  The inertia gain is probably small compared to the inertia of
the
>> >whole car, which is dominated by the engine hanging out in front of
the
>> >front axle.  The increase in rotational inertia (really it's the
first
>> >moment of inertia we are talking about, to be tech-ish), would hurt
you
>in
>> >transitions, but then the improved weight distribution would help
you in
>> >transitions as well as the rest of the turns.  Prolly close either
way,
>and
>> >either way is better than stock, but getting the battery further
back
>than
>> >the rear seat is prolly a very good idea.
>> >
>> >HTH.
>> >
>> >Brian
>> >
>> >
>> > >----- Original Message -----
>> > >From: "Rhett Farnum" <rocco_crossing@hotmail.com>
>> > >To: <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>> > >Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 2:17 PM
>> > >Subject: Re: battery relocation question
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >>
>> > >> So, is a dry cell the same as a deep cycle? Or are they
different and
>> >what
>> > >> is the best to run in our cars.
>> > >>
>> > >> ALSO, I am thinking of putting my bettery where the back
passenger
>seat
>> > >> would be inorder to counter my wieght and balance the car better
>while
>> > >> autoXing. What would be the best way to attach the box and where
to
>run
>> > >the
>> > >> vent?
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Peace Out,
>> > >> Rhett
>> > >> Rocco_crossing
>> > >> '83 Rocco (autocross ready, 20 days till season opener)
>> > >> '92 Olds Cutlass Ciera (DD)
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> >From: "Josh20V" <mkii@nycap.rr.com>
>> > >> >To: <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>> > >> >Subject: Re: battery relocation question
>> > >> >Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 16:35:06 -0500
>> > >> >
>> > >> >just as a side note, this is the one Im going with.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >http://www.jshouseofeuro.com/images/stinger.jpg
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Its a Stinger brand dry cell.
>> > >> >
>> > >> >24.9 lbs / 5" H x 6-9/16" W x 6-7/8" D
>> > >> >
>> > >> >Josh Able
>> > >> >www.JsHouseOfEuro.com
>> > >> >BrandNew Eurobumpers in stock
>> > >> >check out the forums!
>> > >> >----- Original Message -----
>> > >> >From: "Vince Royer" <vince@performancecarstereo.com>
>> > >> >To: "Joe Doty" <Joe.Doty@lcnetwork.com>; "Ryan H"
><rhock99@epix.net>;
>> > >> ><scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
>> > >> >Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 7:21 PM
>> > >> >Subject: RE: battery relocation question
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > > Just a note on all this battery stuff.  Here's my take:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I wanted to get the weight of the battery right between the
2
>> >wheels
>> > >and
>> > >> >as
>> > >> > > low as possible to lower the center of gravity.  In the
future I
>> >think
>> > >I
>> > >> > > will cut out the well and make my own, but I'll wait for the
>stereo
>> > >work
>> > >> >to
>> > >> > > start that.  For now I dropped the battery box down into the
>wheel
>> > >well
>> > >> >as
>> > >> > > far forward as possible and scewed it down.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I'm using 1/0 phoenix gold power cable, through a 350 amp
circuit
>> > >> >breaker.
>> > >> > > I have a distribution block up front sending 4 AWG to the
Starter
>&
>> >4
>> > >> >AWG
>> > >> >to
>> > >> > > the Alternator.  I used the battery I had, it has a vent
hose
>which
>> >I
>> > >> >routed
>> > >> > > out the bottom.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I also have another neat trick.  I recently had my car
stolen and
>> > >really
>> > >> > > don't want it happening again. If a theif cuts your battery
>cable,
>> > >alarm
>> > >> > > goes bye-bye.  So I ran a second 8 gauge cable from the
battery
>> > >directly
>> > >> > > into the main power input from the fusebox.  That way I was
able
>to
>> > >> > > eleminate the old corroded wire coming through the firewall.
>> >Suddenly
>> > >> >all
>> > >> > > my electronic devices performed better - like all the
>> >bulbs/wipers/fan
>> > >> >etc.
>> > >> > > I guess I freed up some electrons, but the biggest thing I
gained
>> >was
>> > >> >the
>> > >> > > security.  Now there is no way of disabling the alarm from
>outside
>> >the
>> > >> >car.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Cheers!
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Vince
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > >> > > From: scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > [mailto:scirocco-l-admin@scirocco.org]On Behalf Of Joe Doty
>> > >> > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 2:29 PM
>> > >> > > To: Ryan H; scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > Subject: RE: battery relocation question
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > I used a bench vise.  Worked great!
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Joe Doty
>> > >> > > IT/Development
>> > >> > > joe@lcnetwork.com
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > >> > > > From: Ryan H [mailto:rhock99@epix.net]
>> > >> > > > Sent: Friday, February 14, 2003 1:30 PM
>> > >> > > > To: scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > > Subject: Re: battery relocation question
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > All this battery talk brings about an interesting question
of
>> >mine:
>> > >I
>> > >> > > > bought the cheapo Summit kit, what kinda tool should I use
to
>> >crimp
>> > >> > > the
>> > >> > > > end connectors (battery terminal connections are
pre-crimped
>> > >already)?
>> > >> > > I
>> > >> > > > don't think my trusty wire cutter/crimper will work for 2
gauge
>> > >wire.
>> > >> > > ;)
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > >
>> > >> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > > Scirocco-l mailing list
>> > >> > > > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Scirocco-l mailing list
>> > >> > > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > _______________________________________________
>> > >> > > Scirocco-l mailing list
>> > >> > > Scirocco-l@scirocco.org
>> > >> > > http://neubayern.net/mailman/listinfo/scirocco-l
>> > >> > >
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> >_______________________________________________
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>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
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>
>
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