[tech]: update--moving timing

[treed2@u.washington.edu (T. Reed)]

Michael.. aren't you the guy that spun a rod bearing (or something along
those lines) in his new 2.0l block last year? Seems like this particular
block is giving you quite a bit of trouble..

> i managed to get off all of my belts and pulleys to check out why my
> timing's been moving.  i turned the crank to get at something better, a=
nd
> found that the crank bolt was loose.  Hmm=85 couldn't get the last cran=
k
> pulley (with the timing mark on it) off.  so i took the crank bolt off,=
 and
> removed the pulley and crank sprocket together.  findings:
> 1)	there was no woodruff key to be found anywhere, or even remnants of =
one
> (i circled where i thought it should be).  this is looking at the insid=
e of
> the crank sprocket;
> www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/pulley.jpg
> www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/beerfest 008.jpg (wider shot=97you can=
 see
> that even though i circled something on the last pic, the inside is act=
ually
> quite smooth).

Wow... See the pictures I just sent you.. same thing pretty much although
in my case there was a teensy bit of metal left.. just enough to hold it
from moving, I think.

> 2)	the slot in the crank didn't look chewed up or anything, but i don't=
 know
> what it should look like (circle where slot is, conveniently covered by
> belt);
> www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/crankpulley.jpg

As long as the two sides of the key slot are parallel I think you're okay.
Buy a new crank sprocket for $30 ($25 from potterman?) and a new bolt and
spacer, and a new crank pulley (or seperate the one you have), and you
should be fine.

> 3)	the crank sprocket and pulley were one piece, like they were welded
> together or something; www.learnlink.emory.edu/~mabatzi/beerfest 016.jp=
g .
> this, iirc, should not be the case.
> what i'm thinking is that someone screwed with this before, welded the
> pulley and sprocket together, and used the crank bolt to keep everythin=
g
> from slipping (which if it was tightened enough would work).  the force=
s
> eventually loosened the bolt, and there was no key to keep things in pl=
ace.
> make sense? so a couple of questions:

Well, welding the pulley and sprocket together would be worthless.. but
that doesn't mean someone didn't do it. There are plenty of stupid shops
and POs..

Most likely, though.. they're just rusted together really good.

> 1)	can i use the sprocket/pulley from my 1.8 shortblock?

Yes. They're identical. The 2.0s came with a different bolt, though.. it
was a 12 point hex bolt (but still a 17mm head) instead of a 6 point. I
think the torque spec changed (from 171 to 80 ft-lbs?) too. At least, my
1.8 had the 6 point bolt and my 2.0 came with the 12.

> 2)	how do i get the crank bolt off? the shortblock is just sitting ther=
e=97how
> do i keep the crank from turning? anyone done this? i have an air wrenc=
h
> coming thurs, but i'd like to get it done before then if possible...

Use the 2x4 on crank counterweight trick as Ron described or put the car
in gear and have someone stand on the brakes so the engine won't turn.

I recommend an impact wrench to get the bolt off and a big ass breaker ba=
r
with clicker torque wrench to put it on. Be 300% sure it is seated
squarely and the key is engaged first, though.

> hopefully this is all that's wrong, and i can slap it all together some=
time
> this week without taking apart the engine as i feared=85
> any other thoughts/suggestions?

You're a lucky bastard. When this happened to me I replaced just the
sprocket and I didn't get away with it because the crank itself was
mangled. It took 12 months for the play introduced by the oversized key
hole in the crank to chomp the new crank sprocket key to dust.

Change the sprocket and you should be good to go. But like I said get the
new bolt and spacer from the dealer.. Don't skimp here, it's your whole
engine at stake. My old bolt was obviously mangled and rusted when I
pulled it off, but I would have gotten a new one no matter what.

Loctite might not be a bad idea either.. just don't plan on removing the
bolt again.. ever..

HTH,

-Toby