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Subaru?

> $60 is nothing compared to a $24k car.
 
Obviously, but that wasn't our discussion.  Your question to Shawn Meze
is how Subaru catered to enthusiasts.  That was just one example.
Dollar amount doesn't matter.  They are showing they care about
enthusiasts.
 
> It's an advertising gimmik.
 
Sure it is!  It helps them sell cars and makes enthusiasts happy.
 
> VW never had any kind of weight distribution, did they?
 
Nope.
 
> Turbos are excellent for racing
 
How are turbos excellent for racing?  Are you saying turbos are
preferable to normal aspiration?

> but not necessarily longevity on the street, VW or otherwise.
 
New turbosystems are expected to last a long time.  The modern turbo
design is much better than years past.  Don't forget VW's 1.8T is also
turbo.  Are you implying Subaru's turbo 2.0 won't last as long as VW's
1.8T? 
Probably too early to tell...

> I'm loving VR6's and I'm hoping they have the same durability as the 4 cyls.
 
VR6s are just as durable, if not more, than the 4 cyls.  I've had two
VR6 cars in the past. They are great engines.  I would love to drive a
new GTI when the 200 hp VR6 becomes available... until reaching the
first curve that is.

> How much heavier are they really?
 
How much heavier than a 4 cyl you mean?  I dunno.. I'd guestimate
100-150
pounds.
 
Mike
> 
> > Erik L
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Mike VanAmburgh" <E30@iLand.net>
> > To: "Scirocco" <scirocco-L@scirocco.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2002 10:36 PM
> > Subject: Re: Subaru?
> >
> > > Erik La Celle wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Doesn't VW offer awd?  4-motion?
> > >
> > > Yes, but just in the Passat and only with automatic.  I wouldn't call
> > > that an enthusiast car.  Probably 75% of car makers these days offer
> > AWD
> > > family cars.
> > >
> > > > Last membership I had with SCCA was $55.00 with now ex-wife...
> > >
> > > It is now $60, which new WRX owners don't pay.  :-)
> > >
> > > > A 24v VR6 is not an enthusiast setup?
> > >
> > > Sure, it's an enthusiast engine, but placing it so that part of lump
> > > hangs even with the drive wheels doesn't actually make for good weight
> > > distribution.  65/35 imbalance does not make for an enthusiast setup.
> > >
> > > > I enjoy the stout engineering/durabilty of a VW.
> > >
> > > So do I.  It would be nice to have a all around performing VW tho,
> > don't
> > > ya think?
> > >
> > > > Do you think Subie's  flat 4 turbo with 227 hp will go the 200-300k
> > a VW will?
> > >
> > > Yep.  Same idea as 180 hp in a turbo 1.8 .. no?
> > >
> > > I used to think just like you until I drove other cars.  I thought
> > VW's
> > > were the best thing out there.  I still love older VWs, but I wouldn't
> > > buy a new one.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > > Erik L
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Mike VanAmburgh" <E30@iLand.net>
> > > > To: "Scirocco" <scirocco-L@scirocco.org>
> > > > Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2002 9:47 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: Subaru?
> > > >
> > > > > > How does Subaru give support to enthusiasts?  Just curious
> > > > > > Erik L
> > > > >
> > > > > Free one-year SCCA membership for WRX owners, contingency money at
> > > > > ProSolo and National autocross events and simply making it
> > possible
> > > > for
> > > > > us to own cool cars such as the WRX.  I just about fell over in my
> > > > chair
> > > > > when VW announced they are bringing over the 24V VR6 with 6 speed,
> > but
> > > > > where's the AWD??  Give us an enthusiast car, VW!
> > > > >
> > > > > Mike
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Shawn C Meze" <skerocdriver@juno.com>
> > > > > > To: <lacelle@frontiernet.net>
> > > > > > Cc: <scirocco-l@scirocco.org>
> > > > > > Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2002 9:15 PM
> > > > > > Subject: Re: Subaru?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Mon, 11 Mar 2002 20:13:40 -0500 "Erik La Celle"
> > > > > > > <lacelle@frontiernet.net> writes:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >Several comments in the thread say VW doesn't offer a good
> > car
> > > > > > > >anymore.
> > > > > > > >How 'bout a 2002 1.8 20v turbo for 18,900?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > idl ike to seeyou or anyone else actually pay $18,900 at this
> > > > point in
> > > > > > > time. Next year, maybe. Expect to shell out well over 23K for
> > one.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > (see www.vw.com)  No good?
> > > > > > > >Also comes with the VR6 should you choose (20,295). But, then
> > > > again,
> > > > > > > >I'm
> > > > > > > >a VW kind of guy -- altogether 8 rabbits, 2 jettas, a Passat,
> > > > > > Vanagon,
> > > > > > > >and Scirocco -- so you're not going to persuade me into
> > something
> > > > > > else
> > > > > > > >without some good reason!
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Well, if I had to pay that much for a car, id be hard pressed
> > to
> > > > buy a
> > > > > > VW
> > > > > > > honestly. Dont get me wrong, I love my VW's as they're very
> > > > > > inexpensive
> > > > > > > to own and opperate. I have a hard time paying that much
> > > > supporting a
> > > > > > car
> > > > > > > company who doesnt support their enthusiasts. Bottom line.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Shawn Méze
> > > > > > > 86' Jetta GLi 8V   88' Corvette -SS 30- 2001 SDR Solo2
> > Champion
> > > > > > > 82' Scirocco GTi -FSP 54-   79' "Project FSP Scirocco"  84'
> > > > Scirocco
> > > > > > 8V
> > > > > > > The Fastest, Quickest, Cleanest and best looking Scirocco(s)
> > in
> > > > all of
> > > > > > > San Diego!
> > > > > > > http://www.Geocities.com/MotorCity/Speedway/1308/index.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > > GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!
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> > > > > > > Join Juno today!  For your FREE software, visit:
> > > > > > > http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > > >
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