On the topic of superchargers

[sfenton@amazon.com (Fenton, Shannon)]

Im assuming you mean 175 to crank.

Shannon=20

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Blain [mailto:rept@qwest.net]=20
Sent: Wednesday, April 24, 2002 4:07 AM
To: scirocco-L@scirocco.org
Subject: On the topic of superchargers


My engine sits at Momentum's shop in Canada- and I have all the=20
components in place to turbo or Supercharge at this point. As it sits i=20
can expect 175+ HP from my lil 2L.   What I'd like to do is find and=20
install one of those clutched on/off superchargers so that the car is=20
manageable under normal aspiration and yet- I can achieve boost when=20
needed at the flip of a switch.
Last year I saw one of these devices on Ebay for 500. It was for an MR2=20
(?). Does anyone on the list know of any Clutched Chargers still being=20
manufactured, that will work for my purpose?


Mike Blain (don't make me dish my pistons punk)

Noah wrote:

>>1) Superchargers are easier to deal with and support
>>as a manufacturer. I would argue that Neuspeed or
>>Jackson racing has far fewer "customer complaint"
>>(what I might call "customer stupidity") issues than
>>Greddy. The fact that boost levels are not directly
>>related to crankshaft speed creates a LOT of issues
>>that the average person can't deal with and tune for properly.=20
>>Wastegates, fueling, timing, etc. are all more difficult to manage=20
>>when you cannot directly tie air consumption to engine speed. Couple=20
>>that with the millions of stupid people out there, and you see why
>>there are relatively few mass-produced turbo kits.
>>
>=20
>     I read all that as saying "Supercharger kits are more proprietary=20
> and thus pretuned to certain boost levels, therefore easier to set up=20
> but less flexible." That is not really something I am in favor of.
>=20
>     As far as using a G-lader based supercharger setup transplanted=20
> from a corrado, I would urge you to reconsider. The G-lader is just=20
> not reliable enough. With stock boost levels it doesnt make good hp=20
> and if you go much over stock you are asking for trouble. As for the=20
> alternatives, the horror story I referred to was a Lysholm (sp?) kit=20
> for the corrado. This thing is totally underwelming powerwise, and the

> bearings in it are SO loud they can be heard above the engine.
>=20
>=20
>>2) The reason I personally am going with a
>>supercharger is due to the intended purpose of my
>>vehicle: autocrossing. The nature of autocrossing
>>means that instantaneous throttle response and a
>>linear torque curve are FAR more important than
>>efficiency and maximum power potential. I'm wondering
>>how in the world I'm going to get 200whp hooked to the ground...300whp

>>in a 1900lb car on an autocross would be completely unmanagable and=20
>>slow me down. I also need to be able to apply power whenever I want,=20
>>*NOW*. There are people who are pretty successful at planning
>>in advance for turbo lag on an autocross, but it is
>>definitely not an ideal situation. If they make a
>>slight mistake in their timing, it costs them several
>>tenths of a second to correct, then potentially a
>>second or more to get the boost back up. That's the
>>difference between an easy 1st place and 10th at a big
>>event.
>>
>=20
> hmm. When I go to the autocross the two biggest stars there are the=20
> mr2...turbo, and the late gen rx7... turbo. Not to mention all the=20
> turbocharged miatas... When you are on a track and you are reacting=20
> solely to the track and not other cars, the turbo shouldn't hurt you a

> bit. In fact the lag (what little there is in any modern turbo car)=20
> will help you stay hooked up, and even keep you from breaking your=20
> car. As you know, it's much more important to be smooth than to be=20
> fast.
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>>Additionally, having a direct relationship between
>>throttle position and power output is a huge
>>advantage. I've talked to enough Supra drivers to
>>understand the issues created when you're navigating a long-ish=20
>>sweeper or a slalom at part throttle in a big-boost turbo car. Just=20
>>about the time you've set the car up nicely for the turn, and balanced

>>the brakes, throttle, and steering on the head of a pin,
>>20psi of boost comes rushing in to mess it all up! At
>>3500rpm a Supra might make 150whp...but 1/2sec later
>>at 3600rpm it could be doing 350whp! There is NO
>>in-between. Managing that situation definitely takes
>>time/attention away from driving faster.
>>
>=20
> So you are saying that he couldn't let off the gas and get thru there=20
> in the same way you would? I'm not sure I can make any kind meaningful

> argument in this example. Far too many variables.
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>>And on top of it all, my rough calculations indicate
>>that, presuming the same intercooler size/location, a
>>G60 setup is probably at least 15-30lbs lighter than a
>>turbo. The G60 itself is only about 15lbs, there's
>>much less plumbing, no extra manifold weight, no
>>wastegate (well, the bypass valve on the TB weighs a
>>few ounces, I suppose), etc. When you rely on light
>>weight to beat 600hp AWD cars, 30lbs does matter.
>>
>=20
> I tend to think the two systems would be basically the same weight,=20
> the only real difference is the wastegate, and it weighs maybe 5lbs.=20
> Regarding plumbing - with a turbo I have one tube running from filter=20
> to turbo, one from turbo to IC, one from IC to intake. You will have=20
> one from filter to blower, one from blower to IC, one from IC to=20
> intake. You will have to move something (Alt, AC, etc) to the back of=20
> the motor or delete it, whereas I can mount all my aux stuff in common

> locations. Not sure how you will mount the intercooler from the=20
> corrado, but it's a pig anyway, you'd be better off with an=20
> aftermarket one, of course if you do that you will be making custom=20
> intake hoses, something you seemed opposed to.
>=20
> Question: which VW chassis are you considering for the swap? A2? If=20
> you are determined to have a Golf with a G-lader, maybe you would=20
> consider buying one already set-up? There's one here that belongs to a

> friend of mine. He's a mechanic with too much going on to mess with=20
> it. He's got about 5k in it I think. It has been described as "Too=20
> fast for that chassis" - He bought it as a track car from another=20
> local dubber. That might be a good deal for you after you consider the

> expense of all the stuff you will need. Looks like the guys did a=20
> pretty good job on it too, I've seen it first hand a couple of times,=20
> but I've yet to ride in it. In NC if it's of any interest.
>=20
> -Noah
> -86 Audi 5ktq
> -84 Audi Quattro
> -82 Chevy Rollback wrecker! 454cu yeehaw!
> -Yard full of VWs that will become one car soon
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>=20
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> Scirocco-l mailing list
> Scirocco-l@scirocco.org=20
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