Re: suspension pros & cons

["Randy B" <sirocco@telocity.com>]

Lloyd,
As far as oversteer/understeer is concerned this should be a property of:
Swaybars front and rear
Tire pressure front and rear

larger rear swaybar (front staying the same size) would increase oversteer.
larger front swaybar (rear staying the same) would increase understeer.
Tire pressure higher in front (rear staying the same) would increase
understeer.
Tire pressure higher in back (front staying the same) would increase
oversteer.
As they say "in a perfect world" of course.

IMO Bilstein Sport shock/struts are the best in the world (Ok so I haven't
tried EVERYTHING out there).
I am a BIG fan of Bilstein shocks so my opinion my be tainted slightly.
I like my Koni adjustables but I have discovered that when I set the Koni's
up to what I consider the "perfect" setting they are very close to what my
aged Bilstein Sports (non-adjustable) delivered.

My evaluation of your account is that "1: Lowering the car too far causes
serious handling issues".

Randy



OK, so explain this to me. I have owned/had four Sciroccos, One of
them was an '85 8v with Tokiko HP struts, stock springs and a lower
stress bar, one of them was an '86 16v with Tokiko HP struts and
stock springs that had been cut down to where the control arms were
parallel, later replaced with a progressive rate spring that lowered
the car the same amount (can't remember the brand, but maybe
Neuspeed), one was an '88 16v with totally stock suspension, and one
was an '88 16v with Bilstein struts, HÖR springs that lower the car I
would guess about 2.5" and polyurethane strut bushings. Of those four
cars, I have regularly taken all down the same stretch of curvy
hilltop road here in Austin, and the car with the Bilsteins and the
super-low springs consistently has more problems with oversteer and
general handling than any of the others, requiring me to take the
road as much as 10MPH slower than I could in any of the other cars.
All of these cars have been aligned at the same shop, and I have
driven them all down the same road in just about every weather
condition with the same 15" rims and same brand of 195/50/15 tires at
the same PSI.

Now, this leads me to believe one of two things:

1: Lowering the car too far causes serious handling issues.
2: Bilstein struts are crap.

I have heard nothing but good things about Bilsteins from everyone I
have ever talked to about them, so that leads me to believe the
problem is the ride height. If you have some insight as to how the
issue is not the ride height, and not the Bilsteins, I would love to
hear it as I am currently trying to decide what to do to improve my
rather lacking suspension.







The goal is to overcome the deliberate nature of the process.

>
>
> Nope, I again completely disagree here too. I get the feeling that
> you might be speaking from a textbook point of view and not of one
> having experienced driving a Scirocco with a 2" or + drop on stiff
> springs. I invite you to come visit me and drive both my 82
> Scirocco (with Group G springs 425#F 250#R spings. 2" drop.) and my
> 84 Scirocco. (with Neuspeed Race Springs @ 300#F 175#R springs and
> 2.5" drop.)
>
> Both cars are not only daily driven cars (my wife drives the 84)
> but they also exhibit great handling on most any surface. We do
> have a wide variety of road surfaces out here in so-cal. Im sure
> its nothing like what all of you 4 seasoners get. Still, id never
> have a stock
> suspensioned VW again. (my GLi has NS Lowering springs too. LOL!!)
> Its just a drivers preference thing more than cosmetics.
>
>

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